Today I recieved an interesting phone call, from Tyler Lowe of RMS Collection Services, regarding an unpaid UPS (United Parcel Service) invoice.
You'd think this would be embarrasing news that I would keep to myself. On the contrare, I am VERY proud of the way I pay my bills -- last year I paid a total of $2.47 in interest.
This is just a short story on a recent experience I had... and how I dealt with it. Read on...
I'm still not 100% sure exactly what happened... I either recieved the invoice and misplaced it, or it was never recieved (read as: lost in the mail). Either way, it's no big deal -- a reminder letter or statement from UPS will make me aware of the unpaid invoice. But that letter never came. Nor did UPS contact me in ANY form (telephone, fax, email, snail mail, etc.).
The original invoice was from June of this year... JUNE and I get a call from a collection agency in DECEMBER? Actually, I got a letter from RMS last Monday... I called UPS and confirmed that I had an outstanding invoice... I sat down, wrote the cheque, mailed it and called UPS back to let them know. One letter, even though it was from a third party, was all it took to make me aware of an error in accounting and the invoice was paid. I asked them to look at my account and see if I've ever been LATE, never mind not paying a bill altogether. The answer was no.
I asked UPS what steps they had taken to contact me as the paperwork recieved from RMS stated that UPS "has exhausted collection efforts" -- no answer was given to me. I told UPS that they did not "exhaust" any efforts as all it took was one letter (a phone call would have sufficed).
You know the saying "SHIT HAPPENS"? Well, shit happens... I'm human... I make mistakes -- and I accept full responsibilty for my mistakes. But to be treated as an absolute low-life because of an oversite (one lost invoice) is sickening -- especially since I've been dealing with them (UPS) for over 10 years and have had not one late payment.
Anyway, back to the original title of this post... are collection agencies a thing of the past? Why do I say that? Well, simply from my telephone conversation with Tyler Lowe from RMS Collections. After he asked for me and identified himself as a collection agency, I said two simple words to him that, litterally, cut the conversation short -- "Prove it".
"Prove it?", said Tyler.
"Yes, prove it.", I said -- "Prove to me that you are who you say you are and are not simply a telemarketing scam -- you are asking for my credit card information and my security code on the back of the card. That, to me, sends up red flags for a scam. Prove that you are a legitimate company, you are gainfully employed by that company and have been hired by UPS to collect an unpaid invoice."
"How would you like me to do that?", was the reply.
"I really don't care.", I said -- "The onis is on you, not me. You are a third party that is making claims with nothing to back them up. Until you can prove to me that you are not a scam, I will have no further dealings with you. Have UPS call me."
Have UPS call me? Yeah, the collection agency is going to call UPS and basically say "We can't collect your invoice as we cannot prove to your customer that we are a legitimate company and your customer will not deal with us... your customer would like you to phone him.". Why would a company, such as UPS, deal with a collection agency if they can't collect?
This post is more of a rant than anything... I am pissed at the way I was treated simply due to an oversite. It is also to let you know that you can stand up for yourself and do not have to deal with these collection agencies, if you ever get put in that situation -- hopefully, you will not. Ask them to "Prove it", or don't give them anything -- then call the company they are "supposedly" collecting for and let them know as well. It's like PayPal always says, always type the URL into your browser and NEVER give information to a third party claiming to be working on the behalf of PayPal.
Let me also make note that I am IN NO WAY telling you to not pay your bills -- that's not what this is about. If you pay your bills, you should never need this information -- but that's not guaranteed either, as my story above explains. Whether you pay your bills on time religously or not, it's always possible that you too will be placed in a situation similar to mine. So, always remember these two words -- "PROVE IT!".
Me too
I also received a letter from collections in the same manner that you did, except I had actually paid COD for a parcel and they were still trying to collect the money on it. I had some very unprofessional responses from one Anna Maria Martin at RMS Collections. I mean, they treat you like a low-life even when you are not. I understand that they deal with people that don't pay their bills and they have to be rude and threatening to get the money out of people sometimes, but when you're innocent like me, being treated like some low-life that can't pay their bills is very non-productive and completely disrespectful.
The same thing happened to
The same thing happened to me. They said I owed them money and that they were going to collect from my employer and it would affect my credit rating. I called UPS with EVIDENCE (my credit card statement) telling them that I had paid on delivery. They checked their system and she said that "it hadn't posted for some reason". She said that she would clear the matter up. We will see if RMS stops harrassing me.
I just called RMS, who has
I just called RMS, who has yet to send me a statement...The original balance was in the neighborhood of $500.00 and is now $96.00, but yet, "Mr Rude"...(and I'm being polite here..).says the had me listed as refusing to pay.....
RMS
Asking a collections "person" to prove that they work for the vendor is a fantastic idea. I received a phone call from Jimmy at RMS last Thursday night. He said that I had a delinquent bill with AT&T from 5 years ago in the amount of $1400.00. AT&T has never contacted me regarding this and I have been using their services all these years.
Well, Jimmy wanted to "clear this matter up" in the form of a check-by-phone, right there on the spot. I asked him to e-mail or fax something in writting. My spidey senses went through the room when I received an e-mail that a 5 year-old could have sent. It was not on letterhead, there was no company name (he claimed to be with RMS over the phone), just a po box number somewhere in PA. There was no sign-off at the end of the letter and his name did not appear anywhere.
If he calls back, I will definitly ask him to prove his identity. Thank you for the tip.
Caroline
UPS and RMS- ME TOO!
RMS is trying to collect money from me for UPS also. I don't owe UPS any money!!! I don't even have an a account with UPS! I sent 3 things thru UPS last year but always paid in advance! I'M NOT PAYING UPS MONEY I DON'T OWE! RMS called 3 times in a 30minute period one night. I called the Sheriffs office and reported them. Sent this company a Cease and Desist certified letter. This coompany continued to call. My lawyer is now going to sue this company. I don't owe UPS one dime! PROVE IT! YES, that works for me. I would definatly like UPS or RMS to prove I owe them anything... I DON'T! This is HARASSMENT AND IM PISSED!
RMS- very unprofessional
I too have been dealing with rms for a couple of months, this time they called to collect on a "clerical error" I explained to the rep "David" that I have requested to receive proof... he got very aggitated. I have talked to several supposed managers,who stated they would prove or remove this account.This time while on the phone with another "supervisor" named simon... I googled rms to get a valid address to send them a "formal letter", once I asked them what the "aggravation fee" would be,and to please send or fax me this offer on company letterhead he became very upset, I explained that I need proof for my records, he hung up on me..... I guess thats how they do buisness. Why not send what was requested? I think it would make their job easier....
Rms Joanne
I want to strangle this bit..! Calling me acting all high and mighty. Ya I wrote a check that didn't clear on time. I am aware and I have been making payments..by no means is that good enough she told me she hopes I lose my business because I am dishonest. Just got off the phone with her and I am so enraged!
I received a letter from
I received a letter from R.M.S. yesterday. It claims that I am indebted to UPS and must be paid immediately; otherwise they will report it to credit agencies. The letter seemed to me as a scam. I called UPS and the guy confirmed it. It was about a shipment on September 2008. He also apologized that I have not received the UPS official invoice before this collection letter.
I did pay the bill through the phone by my credit card.
However I could guess what the scheme behind this story is:
Obviously charging $40 brokerage fee plus $35 international shipping fee (paid in the origin) is not fair for shipping a small device that comes from U.S. to Canada and worth less than $100. UPS know this fact and also know that receiver may do complaint or even don’t accept the parcel and then UPS has to return it to the shipper and this will have a cost for UPS.
Therefore UPS prefers to don't bother the receiver by brokerage fee at moment of delivery and prefer to use "Collection Scam" several months later. This scam definitely is developed very well. When someone receives the collection letter he makes concerned about his credit history rather than the amount of brokerage fee and has no options left other than paying.
If you do search on internet about this issue you will find many people fell into this trap that means it is not about missing of UPS letters or mistakes, but it is a systematic scam.
Same thing as you
I had exactly the same situation as you, no invoice from UPS, but suddenly this RMS sending a rude collection notice. I filled in the fax form and sent it over, then got another rude notice saying to "govern yourself accordingly" because they never processed the fax form. So I called in and left my CC info on the machine, and that never got processed, so I thought I'd better call and make sure the idiots had gotten it. Of course not. Finally I had the guy do it on the phone and send me an email with an acknowledgement of the claim being paid.
It is hard to believe UPS thinks that people will stand for this abusive customer service policy in hard economic times. I'm with you, if they had just sent another letter, it would have been paid without having to resort to this unprofessional firm (that I'm certain UPS owns).
Suffice to say, I take every opportunity to not use UPS. I don't purchase online from anyone using UPS, and specifically choose vendors with their own customs clearing arrangements (free, not $30). And I send a note to vendors saying that I am not purchasing from them because of the way UPS conducts business. A few have been quite responsive to the comment and have taken action to increase their shipping options.
Screw UPS!
Another UPS/RMS Victim
I just rec'd my first letter and voicemail from RMS.
Apparently I rec'd "vacuum batteries" shipped COD from UPS some time ago. Since we live out in the country and were not home at the time of delivery, the driver chose to leave the package at our door. We never saw it, never ordered anything, and don't own any cordless vacuum.
We called UPS after a few letters were sent. Apparently UPS policy is that "drop-off without signature" is up to the drivers discretion. They are unwilling to provide any further info and have now tossed our file to RMS.
This is frustrating and seems very wrong that we have to spend time and energy to resolve this. We also feel this is scam and do not plan to pay even though it's just $36. Next I think I will call the bank to see what we need to do to protect our credit rating.
RMS Collection agency
I am going through a similiar situtation as the rest of the people that have commented. Mine involves BlueCross/BlueShield. It is claiming an overpayment from almost two years ago. I did receive one notice from BCBS but before I could respond I received a collection notice. My wife is sure that the alleged debt has been reported to a credit agency. If so, RMS has violated both federal and Florida credit reporting laws and I will sue them. I'll let you know how it turns out.
UPS/RMS Victim
Here is my horror story,
October 2008 receive a UPS package with fees of $ 296 payable COD I give my credit card number to the delivery, UPS has returned my number wrong when it says invalid card in December I get phone in English I do not speak English I doing research and I realize that the bill is not paid on my card, I post dated checks 3 UPS before the filing date, my bank returned the checks in April I received a call RMS as what needs of 296. plus $ 75 NSF check fee, although I oppose expected, I received no statement of account or phones UPS telling me that he accepted the post dated checks, the checks I have ever returned, so I they made another $ 296 check sent by mail in late April to UPS and the check is made well but UPS has not yet been cashed and my file is still open at RMS, I received a call on Monday of this company, I have warned the company not to make a spot in my file during this time is that UPS is at fault. Excuse my English I am using a translator but I had to make you share my discomfort with UPS experience.
UPS-RMS... Another fun story...
I am currently being chased by RMS due to a UPS delivery which was supposed to have been prepaid. Apparently though, there was a "brokerage fee" which was not mentioned or disclosed until the package was delivered. The driver insisted on immediate payment or the package would be returned to sender, so I wrote a cheque. UPS didn't cash the cheque for 4 months, by which time I had forgotten about it and it was returned by the bank (roughly $20 cheque). I couldn't find any record of having written a cheque in this amount, so thought I would get a letter from the payee to let me know about it.
Next thing I know (2 months after the returned cheque), I received a call from RMS advising me that UPS had "exhausted all avenues" in trying to contact me. They threatened immediate legal action if I didn't pay them the cheque amount plus a $45.00 "Service fee".
I immediately contacted UPS and confirmed the returned cheque was to them. I arranged to make a direct payment to UPS through online banking, and believe it is now cleared up. However, I am still getting calls from RMS, despite offering to prove that I have made the payment. I do not have a credit card, and certainly wouldn't give them any information about one anyways.
How can a company operate like RMS, and still stay in business? They seem to run in violation of most consumer protection laws, and I am sure there have been enough complaints against them to show a pattern of disregard for the law.
RMS is a scam company
The FTC should close RMS, for their collection practices....they called me last week for some unpaid UPS bills, I told them that they are wrong...they wanted to collect the money anyway, they wanted my bank account information, my credit card security codes, they even said they will garnish my paychecks...my God..they call at 3am in the morning, at 4 pm, at 11 am on saturdays, at 2 am on sundays...this is the worst collection agency, they are a nightmare..!
RMS call for somebody else
We have been receiving three calls a day for the past week to our business line. Today, I finally called RMS and got "Linda"... she proceeded to ask me for my personal info and I tried to stop her and tell her that I was a business and that I only wished to get our business phone number removed from their database. I told her our website name and address so she could check our number being listed on our contact page etc.. I even provided her the Case # that was left on the voice-mail messages. She claims that she has removed the phone number from the associated account number. We will see.... *if this worked this might be a way for you to end your calls from RMS too!
I work there and I hate it.
I work there and I hate it. My apologies to you all.
RMS @ work
As of today I have been contacted by the same man 3 times at work!!! All 3 times I have told him I cannot talk to him at work about this matter. He proceeds to ask me how am I going to pay? I can do a phone by check and he can give me a better deal if I pay today. This is for a Sprint bill from 5 to 7 years ago. They have never sent me proof they are who they say they are and so far I am not giving him any information. I told him today "this is the 3rd time you have called me at work and this will be the 3rd time I will tell you I cannot talk to you at work about this and then I told him that he has now violated my rights" and I hung up on him.
Can't talk to a real person
I keep getting phone calls by this company and everytime it says to hit "0" I do so I can talk to an agent but after 2 sentences into it, it automatically hangs up on me. My fear is that they have a record of calling me and can use this against me if they take it to court for a garnishment.. I found this site by trying to find a number to call them back.. I called there 866 number but its another recording.. I never received any mail from them either.. I don't use UPS ever and My cell is owned by the company I work for. So I dont have a clue what they want..
I'm sorry you have had bad
I'm sorry you have had bad experinces with RMS. But I had quite a completely different experince. I talked to a lady named LaShon and she was quite pleasent I to was uninformed by my UPS bill. But do to the fact that I had moved it never crossed my mind that it was a scam. While I had her on the phone, I did my research. I looked up RMS on there website and seemed pretty legit to me. I asked her for her phone num and called her right back, she informed me they did not have extentions because they were in an outbound call center. When I called back she answered. I paid it with my credit card so if there was any fraud I could dispute it with American Express. My point being is everyone has a job to do (those that have employment) so don't be so tough on these guys. I agree do your research..but don't get aggravated because you may or may not have looked over one bill.
I too have received several
I too have received several letters from RMS each in which I have replied to. They are trying to collect a debt for a fraudulent charge. Last year I had a charge on my credit card for an orbitz purchase. I tried to figue out what it was. It was 2 airline tickets one way from Belgium to France. First off, I was never in Belgium or France. Second off I work for an airline and have excellent flight benefits. My credit card investigated the charge last year and it was found to be fraudulent so they credited my account. Now RMS has been harrassing me constantly and ignoring the fact that I said the debt was not a legitimate debt. I pay all my bills in a timely fashion. I am sure I have been late a few times in my life due to an oversight, but I still pay my bills. I never even got an email from orbitz telling me about this so called purchase. It is quite alarming and makes me nervous to do any online transactions. My experience with RMS is they are rude and refuse to answer questions.
RMS (Recovery Management Services?)
These rude jerks call about every month for a Robert Nelson and have a nine digit account number. One time they were calling for Humana.
(We have lived here for 15 years and there is no such person here.)
When I call them and ask them to stop, they can't find the account # or our phone in their list.
FTC should cut their wires.
I assure you I work there and
I assure you I work there and submit resumes as much as I can on break without their knowledge. I hate it, but I know the economy is terrible so I go to work and suffer. I think I am going to get fired soon. I will not cry when that happens.
RMS and Rewards 660
I have been getting harrassing rude, phone calls from outsourced call center reps from RMS for the past 3-4 months. I know that I had a Rewards 660 Visa Card in like 2005, I know that due to job loss I did default on the card but was certain that I had paid it off several years ago with another collection company. I tried calling Rewards 660 only to find out that in December 2008 they were dissolved or sold or aquired by another company. I called that company and they have no record of me in their system. I was told to call Jefferson Capitol they took over accounts that were closed pre 2008, I called them at 800-833-3799 and they also have no record of me. What should I do??? RMS is rude unprofessional and outsourced. HELP
same thing happened to me
They called me in January. I have a similar letter in front of my and I am SO angry. They called me in Jan 2011 about an AT&T account I closed in October 2004. I spent a half an hour on the phone with AT&T this morning, and they are completely unhelpful. They never contacted me about this balance. I'm trying to call RMS back to let them know that the account is settled-- via another collections agency in May 2010 (still SIX years after the outstanding balance) which I think is just RIDICULOUS. I keep getting the busy signal when I try to reach an actual person. I'm so mad I want to sue someone!!!
RMS violation of Federal Law
Well Kyle, they RMS are still up to their ole tricks
I received a phone call from one of their collectors a week or so ago when she started asking me for my personal identification information I stopped her told her I was in an Active Chp 7 Bankruptcy and that her client Waste Management had been listed. Stop calling me
you are not allowed to contact me once a Chapter 7 has been filed. She laughed. Wanted all the information on
my case my lawyer when where...I told her do like all the other collection agencies look it up. Wast management is aware they were sent a notice. On May 28,2011 a letter was sent from RMS again asking for payment. I went on line found the following information which may help one of you in the future:
DARREL HEWSON
VICE PRESIDENT
RMS
240 EMERY STREET
BETHLEHEM, PA 18015
I sent to Mr. Hewson a copy of the collection letter I
received my reply written on the letter as well as an
email directly to him as per his statement on the website
regarding why collect?
In addition I am keeping a log and folder of creditor's
who disregard the Federal law of stopping contact to
submit to my Trustee before discharge so that he/she can
be made aware of the tactic's of these companies.
Waste Management is listed in my filing
Waste Management has not picked up trash nor had a valid open account with me at that address since Oct 2011.
Hope this helps when you are trying to figure out just
what to do with these over reaching types as it pertains to collections. As a foot note let me say that a debt with is over 4years and 3 months old without ANY proveable collection activity meaning vaild address and letters sent with signature required or other trackable
method or documented phone contact are not generally collectable. Check with your state Attorney General's office and the Federal Fair Debt Collections Act on line
at FFDC.gov that is not exact do some checking you will find it.
Landlady in Southern California
My horror story with RMS
Last December(2010) I ordered a parcel that was shipped to me via UPS. First it was delayed by the weather, and second it was delayed by typical UPS incompetance... to top it off, I was not home to receive the parcel, so my husband paid the bill for me.
Three months agom, UPS contacted my home phone number for an account that belonged to someone in Toronto (we do not live in toronto), so how our number became attached to the account, we have no idea. Plus neither my husband or I are called Dave. UPS changes the info, apologies for the error, and that's the last of it... or so we thought.
Two days ago, I get a phone call from RMS. I hang up on the automatic message, thinking, oh god here we go again. I was tired, who could blame me? It's 8am. I reverse look up the number, and coordinate info from the internet. Ups had done it again.
At least that's what I thoght until today. When, my husband called RMS to gather more information, turned out my name was on the file, and that we owed UPS money... 6 months after my husband had charged the exact same amount to our credit card. I have proof on my credit statement that the amount in question was charged to my account. Rude RMS agent said prove it. I told him that I was going to contact UPS regarding this matter. He told me I couldn't, because UPS had sent the file to them, and they couldn't open our file. Hah.
At this point, I called UPS, and started a case from their end. I basically told them, they never contacted me prior to this instance (truth, because they contacted us regarding someone else's bill). Secondly, that I have the charge in question on my credit bill. So we did some reverse look up through their system. Wouldn't you know it that the reference number on my credit statement did NOT come up in their system. The other two reference numbers surrounding that order showed up, but the one in question did not. Strange? Very.
So, come Monday, I should have an answer. And I'll be damned if I ever use UPS again.